Tucker Carlson has interviewed the Hungarian prime minister again after two years. In the half-hour interview, which was posted on Viktor Orban's YouTube channel, the two discussed the war between Russia and Ukraine, the US and the mission of the Hungarian nation.
Tucker Carlson began the interview by saying that in the United States, the view is that Ukraine is winning this war.
It’s a lie. It’s not just a misunderstanding, it’s a lie. It’s impossible. Everybody who’s in politics and understand the logic the figures the data know why it is impossible,
Viktor Orban remarked, adding that “my heart is with [the Ukrainians].” Asked why Ukraine’s victory is impossible, he said: “they will run out of soldiers earlier than the Russians,” and “what finally we account is boots on the ground.”
The Russian army is far more numerous, there are many more Russian soldiers than Ukrainians.
he underlined. That is why the strategy the West follows is a badly engineered one by which Russia cannot be beaten.
In the West, the focal point of political debate is freedom, the premier said. When, however, you talk about politics in Russia, the number one issue is how to keep the country together.
He also called attention to the fact that towards the end of Boris Yeltsin’s time in office, when his power was weakening, the West was afraid that Russia, a country with a vast nuclear arsenal will descend into anarchy.
We forgot how dangerous Russia can be if it’s not under a strong leadership, or there is an interregnum. An interregnum is the worst case scenario, PM Orban emphasized. Tucker Carlson, however, remarked that it is “the goal of the US State Department.”
If this is the goal, it’s a mistake,
the premier said. PM Orban added that this is “more than dangerous. To be sitting in Washington it is a different feeling than to be sitting in Budapest, he noted. Ukraine is a neighboring country so what is going on there “could have an immediate impact” in Hungary in 24 hours, and it is a defining factor in the Hungarian approach.
PM Orban then went on to talk about the involvement of ethnic Hungarians in the war and the situation of the Hungarian minority in Transcarpathia.
We have a strong minority, more than 150 000 people, in the territory of Ukraine. The area was earlier part of Hungary so it's a historical minority. They are part of the Ukrainian State and they are being conscripted now to the army and are fighting and dying for Ukraine as Ukrainian citizens,
the premier said, pointing out the fact that “at a certain point they're going to need more soldiers.” It is very risky, as if any Western Country were to send "boots on the ground," that would mean a direct war between the West and Russia.
Asked about the bombing of the Nord Stream pipeline, the prime minister said that after the incident, he, along with Serbia’s prime minister and president, said that if anyone carried out such an attack on the southern pipeline, it would be considered a cause for war or a terrorist attack by the countries of the region.
As regards the United States, PM Orban said that the only way out of the current situation is to “call back Trump” so that he could pursue a foreign policy similar to his previous one.
He had the best foreign policy in decades. He did not started another war. He treated North Korea, Russia, and even China well and pursued a policy that was the best for the Middle East,
Viktor Orban said, adding that if Trump had been the president at the moment of the Russian invasion, the Russians would not have been able to invade the country.
Talking about Ukraine's NATO membership, Tucker Carlson recalled the security conference in Munich before the war broke out, when US Vice President Kamala Harris told Zelensky at a press briefing that they wanted Ukraine to join NATO. Mr Orban said there was a better chance of this around 2007-2008, when “Russia was not strong enough to stop it”, but the issue was postponed and Moscow has since become stronger, so the “this window of opportunity is not open anymore.”
We cannot afford to turn the long border between Russia and Ukraine into a NATO border. This would mean immediate war, a danger for all of us, even for Washington.
said Viktor Orban, who believes that “we should make a deal with Russia on a new security architecture” that would give Ukraine security and sovereignty, but not NATO membership.
Talking about a peace settlement, PM Orban said that first the US should “publicly acknowledge that the key is in your hands.” If the US wanted peace, there would be peace “the next morning.” He called it “obvious” that the Ukrainians would not be able to hold out if they were left alone.
The solution is in the hands of your president
the premier reiterated.
Several questions were also raised about the mission of the Hungarian nation and its situation. PM Orban said that the fact that the Hungarian language and culture had been preserved for so many years was in itself “a great achievement.” According to the prime minister, there is a widespread belief in Europe that the most important thing is the individual, while another approach is that there are other things more important than the individual, such as family, nation and God, and that these should be held in higher esteem than one’s own self. Hungary belongs to the latter camp.
This group of people is in majority here in Hungary,
he remarked.
Commenting on the US administration's regular criticism of Hungary, Mr Orban said that it is always dangerous in international politics when the US believes that a particular country is not moving in the right direction, but it should be remembered that this is only the voice of the US government.
Not all Americans have the same approach as the government. The Republicans, for example, are far closer to us on value basis. The previous president is a friend of Hungary on a value basis historically and wholeheartedly. So we must not make the mistake of equating the United States with the United States government,
Viktor Orban said. Although Hungary is a US ally and a NATO member, the US treats it worse than it treats Russia, he noted. The Hungarian prime minister also said that Hungary is now strong enough that the Biden administration can no longer put the Hungarian economy under the same pressure as it did even a decade ago.
Tucker Carlson asked the Hungarian prime minister about his opinion on the fact that he has been dismissed in American media as “a puppet of Russia, a friend of Putin’s.”
In response, the PM Orban said that during their first meeting with Vladimir Putin, they said that they would avoid discussing history, “because the history between Russia and Hungary is rather sad.” That is why the Hungarian government is trying to maintain a rational relationship with Russia, especially regarding the economy and energy.
My personal opinion, he said, is that without involving the Russians into a security architecture of Europe, we cannot provide a safe life to the citizens of Europe. But now everything is going against it,
he remarked. The official position of NATO is currently in line with the Hungarian position, namely that everything must be done for peace, he noted. This is why it must be made clear that US foreign policy supports the Ukrainians, but “it's not the policy of NATO, it's the policy of United States”, Mr Orban said.
NATO is currently much stronger than the Russians and that Hungary is therefore in a secure position, PM Orban stressed. At the same time, Russia does not threaten the security of NATO countries.
However, according to Mr Orban, part of the strategy of some NATO leaders and the leaders of some member states, such as the US, was to “crush the Russians.” They wanted to achieve that by having Ukrainian soldiers fight, with some NATO member states financing this fight with money and military equipment.
The Hungarians said from the very beginning: this strategy will never work. So it is a bad strategy,
PM Orban said. “After a year and a half this is now clear, and we need a new strategy, or we must achieve peace as soon as possible,” he added.
Cover photo: Prime Minister Viktor Orban and US conservative political commentator Tucker Carlson, former Fox News anchor (Photo: Facebook.com/orbanviktor)
